VR!

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Snowy
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Re: VR!

Post by Snowy » Thu May 02, 2019 5:36 pm

I had a similar issue but resolved it by swapping the connectors around.
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Raid
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Re: VR!

Post by Raid » Thu May 02, 2019 6:52 pm

No amount of swapping made any difference. I had a total of 10 USB ports prior to today, 6 of which were USB 3 and 4 USB 2. I've tried every combination I can think of swapping between the two types.

The Inateck card arrived, and after it took an hour to fit (there was some sort of problem with the PCIE version my motherboard was using), the problem remains. It's improved, sure, it seems having one sensor plugged into the existing ports and one into the new card is the best solution, but the tracking isn't perfect and it loses its positioning fairly frequently. Part of this is probably down to my sensor placement; this room isn't particularly helpful in its layout and the cables for the sensors just aren't long enough to mount them to the walls as I suspect is needed. I know you can buy extension leads, but that's another minefield of unsupported hardware to navigate and I'm done spending money trying to sort it anyway.

So yeah, I'm looking forward to when the new range of headsets is in the public's hands so I can decide what to replace this thing with.

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Drarok
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Re: VR!

Post by Drarok » Fri May 03, 2019 10:14 am

What an odd and infuriating problem. 😕

I don't know that many people with VR headsets personally, but of the ones I do (who also have Oculus rather than Vive), I've not heard of the tracking being so woeful!

Odd question… are there any large reflective surfaces in the room? Mirrors, windows, etc?

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Raid
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Re: VR!

Post by Raid » Fri May 03, 2019 10:36 am

The tracking is affected by the occasional disconnects rather than it being a consistent problem. In Superhot yesterday one of the sensors disconnected, and when it reconnected the system thought my left hand was about two feet to the right of where it was, and the game then played completely normally but with one hand offset. This only happened once, and restarting the software sorted it. I don't think the *quality* of tracking is much of an issue, though I'd have to go and play something like Space Pirate Trainer or Robo Recall to check, as those are titles I've played before.

My comments on room layout are more to do with occlusion than anything else. There aren't any reflective surfaces that the sensors can see and neither one can see the window, but there are odd little angles where objects on my desk do hide the controllers from them. The two sensors are placed at different heights, so I would have thought that they'd be capable of dealing with one sensor being blocked, but that doesn't seem to be the case. It's irritating though that the software will not allow me to have both sensors pointed inwards so that they can cover the same area; the setup process forces you to "correct" their angle so that they're parallel, even in my very small play area where double coverage would obviously be beneficial. If you ignore the setup procedure the software does work, but you can't use the Guardian system, and as my room is filled with model robots that wouldn't stand an impact with a controller, I'm not prepared to do that.

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Raid
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Re: VR!

Post by Raid » Sun May 05, 2019 2:35 pm

So with my new and better functioning sensor setup, I've finally gotten around to putting some time in with Superhot VR. The original Superhot was one of my favourite indie games of recent years, but sadly I've found the VR version pretty frustrating. Granted, I don't have a very large play area (I basically have to play standing still), and the game can be difficult to play with this restriction. Unlike most arcade shooters I've tried in VR, there doesn't appear to be any sort of teleport ability, and objects that you need to complete a challenge are occasionally out of reach. You don't seem to be able to affect objects that are outside of your field of view either - I've found myself reaching for objects that are flying over my head and even when I know my hand should be in a position to grab it, it doesn't work. Throwing doesn't seem very intuitive either; in the original I got used to throwing empty guns at enemies to make them drop their own, but I just can't seem to get the trajectories right in this. And lastly, it feels like there should be an easy way of advancing time without having to dance a little jig - there's a level that starts with you literally dancing in a club surrounded by people with guns, and you just need to survive for long enough before it lets you move to the next position, and it's just a bit dull having to wave your hands around constantly to advance time.

I can see what they were going for with this, and clearly publishing the game when they did has worked out exceedingly well, but I think this one needed a little longer in the oven for my tastes.

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Lee
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Re: VR!

Post by Lee » Sun May 05, 2019 9:22 pm

Aye when you play it standed it's a right mess at times. Things always seem to be that bit further than your reach or the next part Triangle thing is inside you or behind you. Had to rearrange the room to make it more playable.

Throwing things I just got used to wrist flicks and it seemed to work better for me in hitting the dudes.
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Raid
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Re: VR!

Post by Raid » Sat May 25, 2019 3:06 pm

lol oops.

Image

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Raid
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uake

Post by Raid » Sat May 25, 2019 5:12 pm

Ok, so first impressions.

Visuals - Do you remember the first time you used a 3D accelerator card? How about going from the original Doom to Half Life? It's a bit like that. Honestly, the visual upgrade is really quite dramatic. Text is completely legible without having to concentrate. Using this makes it feel like I'd accidentally stapled a sieve in front of my original Rift lenses. I know I'm being a bit hyperbolic, but the increase in fidelity is *huge* for me. It does help that I'm now able to use my glasses inside the new headset, but they're only a minor fix to my vision - I can see pretty well without them. The screen door effect is not entirely absent, but you can't see it without concentrating on individual pixels, and god rays are massively reduced too. The sweet spot for clear vision is larger than on the Rift.

Tracking - Early impressions are that it's very good, but this needs a little extra time to confirm. I had some minor hitches that may have been caused by the game not having a flawless frame rate rather than the cameras losing their tracking. The controllers did occasionally jump to the wrong position, but moving my hand so that said controller was in front of the headset fixed it immediately. Again, this may have been the game rather than the tracking - Robo Recall hasn't been updated yet and uses the old controller virtual models still; a patch may sort this out.

Controllers - They're not quite as nice as the original Touch controllers. The triggers don't seem to be quite as reliable, and in games that require you to press them rapidly (say with the semi-auto pistols in Robo Recall) they miss the occasional shot. The analogue sticks are still some of the best I've used, so much so that it feels like they're wasted on controllers where they're relegated to a tertiary control.

Audio - In a mirror to the visual upgrade, this is such a massive downgrade to the original Rift's excellent headphones that it's embarrassing. Think going from a decent pair of PC speakers to that kid at the back of the bus playing drum and bass through his phone speaker. I really don't think I'm overstating quite how bad this audio-piping solution is; there is absolutely no bass whatsoever, and the gunshots in Robo Recall sounded more like soap bubbles popping. I did go into this purchase with this in mind (in fact it was my main reason for initially wanting Valve's Index instead) and have a solution involving 3D printed parts and taking apart a set of Koss Porta Pros that were the guts of the original Rift earpieces.

Fit - The new facial interface feels nicer than the Rift's, though I can't say how much of that is the fact that it's brand new rather than being soaked with sweat and dead skin. I now can't see through the nose gap which will possibly be problematic, but I think I can probably adjust the fit to aid this. The halo design is going to take a bit of getting used to; for one you have to put the face part on first, differing from the original Rift which had you put the rear of the headset on first to grab the lower part of the back of your skull. The adjustment dial on the back of the halo makes tightening the headset much easier. I think this may be an improvement overall, but I'll have to have worn it for a few hours before I can make that judgement. As with the original Rift, I've had to tie the cable to around the back of the headset and down over my right ear, as the cable exits the face part on the left hand side and my PC is to my right. I used to drape the cable over my shoulder, which tended to drag over my neck. I find it a bit odd that they still don't give you an option for this in the box; I've had to use a bit of velcro.

Extras - The passthrough system, wherein you can see the camera image from the tracking cameras, is a big plus point for me. It's unbelievably easy to set up the system now because of it. Rather than faffing about walking around your room with a controller tracing your play area with a controller's physical location, trying not to block the tracking camera's view, you point a virtual laser pointed at your floor and map out exactly where you want the boundary to be. If you stick your head through the virtual boundary, the display switches to the passthrough allowing you to effectively step out of VR without needing to take the headset off.

---

I've seen a lot of commenters saying that this isn't a big enough upgrade over the original Rift, but I'm not so sure. The audio solution is absolutely crap, there's no doubt there, but the visual upgrade is significant.

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Re: VR!

Post by Mogster » Sun May 26, 2019 12:33 pm

Nice review. I have a DK2 (bought boxed and unopened off eBay for £99...) that I mess around with from time to time, it might be time to retire it.

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Raid
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Re: VR!

Post by Raid » Sun May 26, 2019 2:33 pm

I finished off Super Hot VR this morning, and found it less frustrating with the new headset. At one point I was forced to get down on the floor and crawl underneath my real desk to reach a gun that I needed. I absolutely could not have done that with the old one, as the sensors used to be on top of that desk. I think that for those of us with very small play areas where you need to work around furniture, the inside-out tracking solution is preferable to the outside-in system, as I expected would be the case. I had no issues whatsoever with the controller tracking today, so I think the issues I had yesterday were momentary glitches rather than real problems.

I gave DCS a brief try last night, my main use case for VR, and it was just a massive improvement. In the old Rift, I had to use the zoom control to be able to read the text on the MFDs. I no longer need to do that with the Rift S. I will note however that the FOV is slightly smaller in the new headset; the downside of pushing the lenses forward to fit glasses is that you can't quite see the edges of the displays. For those that don't know, the Rift S got rid of the mechanical IPD adjustment of the original and instead opted for a mechanical "eye relief" slider that shifts the lenses and screen forward or back. You therefore get the option of a larger FOV if you don't wear glasses, something that I need to decide whether it's worthwhile for me.

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Drarok
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Re: VR!

Post by Drarok » Tue May 28, 2019 10:33 am

Mogster wrote:
Sun May 26, 2019 12:33 pm
Nice review. I have a DK2 (bought boxed and unopened off eBay for £99...) that I mess around with from time to time, it might be time to retire it.
I upgraded from the DK2 to the consumer release and that alone was a big difference. Found this article with pictures of the difference if you're interested. That was a worthy upgrade for me, so going to the Rift S from the DK2 should be a huge change.

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Alan
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Re: VR!

Post by Alan » Sun Aug 11, 2019 8:23 am

Picked up a Dell WMR.

WAY clearer in Elite than Vive, all text was perfectly readable. MS let you use a mouse as a VR controller for navigation and it works well if limited, Steam should really incorporate this. Real quick and easy to set up and real easy to use in steamVR titles.

The bad though.... the lenses are shit. The sweet spot is so small and everything but that is just a blur. If you move your eyes slightly all you see is out of focus mess. If you keep your eyes pointing forward its cleaner and clearer than Gen1 Vive but any deviation just kind of takes you out of the experience in a way it never did with my Vive. To make that worse its also not quite as secure on the head as the Vive, its not a lot of movement but when the sweet spot is so small its a bit of an issue on more active games. Theres also no IPD adjustment if you have a less than standard eyeball configuration.

If all you want is something to play Elite on or any other sit down game its probably worth it because its so cheap (£90-120used without controllers, £140-160 with) but I feel like if you have the option to spend a bit more it might be an idea. I could see me playing a bit of Elite on it but I think I'll just send it back.

I believe all WMR use the same lenses but I'm not 100% on that so the other non-Dell ones might be better but I dont know.
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Rusty
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Re: VR!

Post by Rusty » Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:52 am

Anyopne picking up the Beyond update on No Man's Sky? Should be adding VR.

I've left my PC on so I can remote in and start the download whilst I'm at work.

Oh and I've just taken hold of a Valve Index. Want to see what Elite etc are like in the new improved resolutions...
-- To be completed at some point --

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Snowy
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Re: VR!

Post by Snowy » Wed Aug 14, 2019 1:29 pm

Am jealous.

That said, been doing engineering stuff on Elite which means buggy use, so have not been near the VR for a while now. Buggy in VR is the vomet comet for me.
RCHD wrote:Snowy is my favourite. He's a metal God.
08/10/2003 - 17/08/2018
10501 :-({|=

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Snowy
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Re: VR!

Post by Snowy » Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:59 pm

Come on tell me about the Index - how much of an improvement is it to the Rift?
RCHD wrote:Snowy is my favourite. He's a metal God.
08/10/2003 - 17/08/2018
10501 :-({|=

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